Kat Reply:
April 26th, 2007 at 19:55

Tina, wait! I don’t want to be your dream smasher. There are ways for Americans and other non-EU citizens to live and work in Greece, as I said.

Here are a few ways:

1) You could come as a tourist and take illegal work without insurance; some people do this just for the experience of doing it and gain the boss’ good graces, then either go home or try very hard to find an employer willing to give you a work visa, go home and re-enter on the visa;

2) If you have been working for many years for an American company with a branch in Greece, perhaps they could transfer you if you can speak the language or have worked here before — your salary may decrease to reflect Greek standards, but at least you’ll be here;

3) Some employers hire out of desperation, and this could work to your advantage;

4) Some people come here, fall unexpectedly in love with someone Greek or European, get married and their legal issues are solved that way. They still need to go home and re-enter, but it all works out;

5) Some simply have connections or catch a lucky break.

All in all, a dream come true is not going to come to you, you have to go after it.

If you go after your dream, these are my suggestions:

1) Pay off your credit cards, but don’t cancel them in case you need them in an emergency,
2) defer student loans if you have them (you are not absolved from paying them),
3) save some money,
4) keep a presence back home with mail going to a trusted friend or relative,
5) be very open to taking work you wouldn’t normally do,
6) live your dream while you’re still young enough to recover and advance your life goals (travel, career, family, purchase a home, etc.) if living here doesn’t work out.

I’d like to also point out that there are many beautiful countries in this world outside the EU. This is not the only place to live and work.

I wrote the article and created this website because I want people to know the law, the bureaucracy involved and how working conditions are different. Essentially, I want people to have all of the information necessary to make informed choices and not be surprised. Sometimes surprises are good, sometimes not.

Kat Reply:
September 4th, 2007 at 21:57

Getting into a gallery requires some very inside connections, and then you compete with cheaper Eastern European artists who are willing to take less than you likely would.

Some people who have deals with a gallery take cash under the table, thereby skirting the need to get a self-employed status and cutting receipts. This would entail taking 20 percent of wholesale, give or take.

(The two previous statements are based on experience, not rumors. I have an artist friend who does this with connections he’s had for 15 years.)

I’m not sure why you’re mentioning a visa. Visas are for entering, visiting and exiting, not staying in Greece. Permits are for staying in Greece, as I already explained above.

A residence permit is required of non-EU citizens for stays beyond the visa’s validity period (i.e. beyond 90 days if it’s a Schengen tourist visa used by an American). There are dozens of different residence and work permits; therefore, I have no way of knowing which one you qualify for; I don’t represent the Greek government. But most are based on established work in the country, retirement with independent means, being an entrepreneur, consultant or student, residence supported with funds from outside Greece, being the spouse/child of an EU or Greek citizen. Options are listed above, and you can look under the “Residence-Work Permit” category for examples. My site is a starting point, therefore I encourage people to consult Greek authorities for advice pertaining specifically to their situation.

Note to readers: As per the “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me” policy, please use the ‘Search’ or ‘Categories’ BEFORE asking a question. I invested hundreds of hours and the trouble to write up a lot of useful information for everyone, the least you can do is take a look first. If I don’t publish your question or answer you via email, it means the answer is already on this site. Thank you!

Kat Reply:
October 17th, 2007 at 20:07

The unfortunate part is getting an AFM and residence permit based on work requires that you exit the country and enter again with a work visa for Greece secured for you by the employer. This requires quite a bit of bureaucracy and a significant deposit on the part of the employer, and most do not want to bother when they can hire an EU or Greek citizen very easily.

Kat Reply:
October 18th, 2007 at 21:59

Hi there! Simply being registered in an oikogeneiaki merida doesn’t grant you the right to work or live in Greece if you yourself are not a Greek citizen. Therefore, as the article says, you need to have or get Greek citizenship since you have that option as a person of Greek origin; they will not allow you to get a permit as an American or other non-EU citizen. There are plenty of articles about those two subjects on this site in categories called “Residence-work permits” and “Greek citizenship,” and links were already provided above in this article.

Alternatively, you could ask your parents or call the Greek Consulate nearest your home to advise you.

Kat Reply:
October 28th, 2007 at 19:01

The possible options/processes that apply to you are already described in this post.

A “national visa” is for third country nationals for transit between a non-Schengen to a Schengen country within 5 days; there is no such thing as a “long term visa.” There is, however, a type ‘D’ visa that is issued to people with intention to immigrate and gives the bearer the right to apply for a permit upon arrival in Greece. Visas are for entering/exiting; permits are for staying in the country.

Most employers do not apply for permits, IKA and AFMs for workers because identification and signatures require an individual to appear in person. The employer provides the work contract and letter, and the rest of it is up to you (as I say in the post); other commentators confirm what I say. The processes of getting an AFM and IKA are described in detail in other articles on this website.

To answer your question, it only took me 15 minutes to get an AFM, but people will tell you it varies widely because some tax offices want to see the residence/work permit before issuing one, and some municipalities want you to show your AFM before giving you a permit (Catch 22). It only took me a half hour to get IKA, but it varies widely.

It takes anywhere from 90 days to a year to get the permit as I mention in other posts, but the bebaiosi (blue receipt/certificate with photo) they give you for completing your file suffices to start work. Everything must be in place before you start work. You could technically work before that, but if the employer goes back on his word or you fail to finish your AFM/IKA/permit file, the employer is not obligated to pay you and you’ll have no right to complain or stake a claim…unless you find a kind-hearted person.

Please use the ’search’ and ‘categories’ options as I request in my “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me” section.

Good luck!

Kat Reply:
December 8th, 2007 at 19:03

Fadi, I don’t make a habit of contacting readers by phone as this is a site that I run in my free time to help people and generates no income, so I removed your phone number to protect your privacy.

There a few things that don’t make sense in your inquiry, but I’ll get to that in a second.

First, a student visa entitles you to a residence permit, and that residence permit entitles you to get an AFM. That’s true. As a student, you are entitled to work part-time in Greece, but not full-time and not without IKA.

Second, according to Greek law and municipality documentation, a resident permit secured by a student visa cannot be converted to a work permit with a company. Why? Because your visa was a student visa, not a work visa. I’ll give you an example: I have a non-EU friend who attended university here in Greece for 4 years with a student visa, which allowed him a resident permit and to work. When he graduated, he found a stable job with a big well-known bank. The bank used their connections to try and convert his student residence permit into a regular work permit, could not do it, and he is back in his homeland without possibility to come back until the bank proves that the position cannot be filled by a Greek person. When they prove it, they can issue him a work visa to invite him back to Greece, then give him a work permit. It’s been one year and nothing happened. If you and the company are indeed trying to convert a student residence permit to a regular work permit, it’ll be denied at some point.

Third, you state that you already applied for the work permit and have an official paper (bebaiosi; blue paper with photo). This is where it becomes unclear. If you already applied for a work permit a month ago, you’re basically telling me that your employer has already given you a work contract and IKA, and therefore has already hired you since the official paper (bebaiosi for the work permit) is enough to start working and must be done within 8 days of hiring, which means you should already be working.

So either: 1) You didn’t get a work contact and IKA, and therefore didn’t apply for a work permit, which means he never hired you; or 2) your boss did give you those things (which means he already hired you), you applied for the work permit, have the bebaiosi (blue paper for work permit) and now the employer is telling you he wants to fire you. Also note that if you do not get IKA with your work contract, the municipality will not give you a work permit; you must have both.

What it sounds like to me is you never got a work contract and IKA, and you only have a residence permit based on being a student, and you’re working illegally.

No matter what the case, I can tell you very certainly that there is absolutely nothing you can do to make anything go faster in Greece unless you have connections to high authorities that can make calls on your behalf. The process can take anywhere from a few months to after the permit expires.

Kat Reply:
January 18th, 2008 at 20:08

P – Finally, someone who pays attention, has something to contribute and didn’t ask a redundant question!!! Hello and welcome! Thank you for sharing your story, in fact I think it helps for people to see the process and waiting time required of an American (non-EU) citizen being issued a Greek work visa and doing things the right way.

There was a delay in answering your question not only because of technical reasons and my own time constraints, but also because I wanted to research the law more thoroughly.

1) The law did not change: The law as written requires someone to be issued a work visa for Greece while still in their homeland. However, as you illustrated, it is difficult to find an employer willing to do this unless you come here and interview for the position. I know few employers in Greece who would choose to hire a non-EU citizen without hesitation, then go through the trouble of mucking through the bureaucracy to bring them over without ever meeting them.

2) If you were here before January 2005: There was a legalization process for undocumented workers (which I allude to in the article, and contains a link to a more detailed post) that non-EU immigrants could have gone through to get a permit without going back to the homeland and being issued a work visa if all these were true:
a) Proof they were here by December 31, 2004;
b) entered the country legally, but for some reason didn’t qualify or get a permit;
c) had gainful employment;
d) had insurance or could purchase it.
This legalization deadline was extended to October 2007 and the IKA ensima requirement lowered, but the December 31, 2004 cutoff was never changed to include arrivals after that date.

3) Loopholes: There are a number of loopholes or lucky breaks someone could catch made possible by municipal employees who overlooked or were not informed about certain requirements, which allowed some non-EU citizens to apply for a permit without having to return to the homeland and be issued a work visa.
a) If an applicant had everything but the work visa, the application was submitted anyway and the permit was issued;
b) If a municipal employee made an error in accepting or submitting paperwork (which is common at smaller municipalities, where employees don’t know anything about visa waivers or Schengen visas for Americans), higher authorities invited you by letter to apply for a permit anyway, as long as you had everything but the work visa;
c) Perhaps a previous presence in Greece, either an expired resident permit, old green card or any type of application that wasn’t processed fully could get you another bid at a permit;
d) Connections are used or a favor is called in by an employer

I know two non-EU citizens of no Greek origin, who secured permits as recently as 2007 without having a work visa or a previous presence in Greece. As I did not accompany them when doing the paperwork and they are not a long-time friends, I cannot speak intelligently or verify what took place to get it done; it’s very possible they are liars and/or braggarts. I secured my original permit many years ago without a work visa, without connections and without going through the legalization drive.

4) More enforcement: This is the main thing that has changed. While other countries reap the financial benefits of allowing well-to-do foreigners to reside or work in their country with or without permits, Greece has become more rigid and stepped up enforcement of the law, while the law gets more strict and less transparent (i.e., changes are never announced) and fines/penalties get stiffer for employers hiring illegals and/or mistreating workers. There are more immigration checks at workplaces where foreigners are typically hired (English language schools, bars, tavernas, hotels/hostels, etc.), and municipalities are less tolerant or more informed (not always, as mentioned above) when taking permit applications.

Although you waited 9 months for the process to run its course, I still think it’s an accomplishment for which you should be grateful and take pride because I can count at least 1,000 people who tried and never made it. Hundreds more are illegal workers here with no alternative to getting a Greek residence/work permit.

I hope that clears things up a bit. Cheers.

P.S. Are you saying this is not the best resource, but merely just “one of them?”

Kat Reply:
February 28th, 2008 at 20:09

Hi Damian, you and Philip are different cases, so don’t confuse your situation with his. As stated in my article, you apply for your residence/work permit in Greece before your visa expires as the spouse (family member) of a Greek citizen. I regret that I cannot show preferential treatment to anyone (it’s all or nothing when it comes to access), but it is quite easy and requires the fewest papers. A lawyer is quite unnecessary, however I suppose that’s a personal choice.

Phillip is American, of no Greek origin and not married to a Greek citizen (he says this in his comment). He came here on a tourist visa, found a job, exited GR and came back on a work visa and got his permit, which is the correct way to do it in his case.

There’s no such thing as a resident visa.

Mucho thanks for the nice words and recognition on your previous comment.

Kat Reply:
March 18th, 2008 at 21:20

You didn’t read the article on Greek citizenship by naturalization correctly. It’s 10 of the last 12 years of residence; therefore it’s 12 years before you can apply.

Your question about visas and exiting every three months has already been answered with the article. There’s nothing to clarify.

If you are not already married, you must marry within 30 days of arriving in Greece then apply for a Greek residence permit based on being the spouse of a Greek citizen. He must meet insurance, income and residence requirements. It’s not automatic.

Kat Reply:
September 6th, 2008 at 18:11

P – Hello, welcome and thank you for your kind words. I didn’t answer right away because I’d hoped that you might find the answers to your questions by reading other posts and comments, but it sounds like you didn’t.

Nowhere on this site have I stated that I’m moving back to the USA, so I’m not sure why you think this; my belief is that people make assumptions based on my nationality and forget that I earned the right to live/work in the EU. I suppose many Americans go back because they have family or somewhere to stay; I do not. My family is dead, there is no family home and I’ve been gone for 11 years so my career contacts are irrelevant. Returning as an American with a non-American fiance also means a large burden on me, which you can read about on the USCIS website.

I maintain a certain level of privacy because I value it and this site is only in small part about me. Its mission was and still is to make Greek bureaucracy more transparent for others and relay stories not covered in English and/or with a different perspective as a career-minded, single non-EU woman in Greece. If I tell my entire story about moving, living, working and leaving Greece, it will not be on this site and it will be in my own time.

The economic downfall is not confined to the USA, as you know; it’s everywhere. If you look at the Cost of Living Index, Greece’s cost of living is still rising even as notoriously expensive countries such as the UK, Switzerland and Sweden go down. It is still much cheaper to live in America than Greece, not just because of the strength of the euro, but also because of corruption, price gouging, consumer spending being fueled by loans and credit (without limits), cartels, monopolies, a collapsing SS system and a decrease in foreign investors, tourism and trading in Greece. However, even with all of these factors, people do still move here for their own reasons, see “Should I move to Greece?”

If you look under “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me,” you’ll see the reasons I do not list my email address and why I do not start a forum.

Kat Reply:
November 28th, 2008 at 23:44

It’s better to wait for the metaklisi than to come to Greece illegally, as explained above. Not just to have insurance, but also to be legal and have rights. You cannot come to Athens, Greece as a tourist and apply for a work visa while here. You must apply for a work visa outside Greece and then enter the country, then apply for the work permit after arrival.

There’s no way to speed up the process.

Kat Reply:
December 8th, 2008 at 21:22

I’ve received all 3 identical comments. However, I encourage you to read “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me ” on the front page, which says that all comments enter moderation and are typically not published right away, especially if someone is requesting information from me that will require more than a quick answer, which is what you’re asking.

Since you cannot wait for a proper and more thoughtful answer, I’ll give you a general answer instead. Read:
1. Read the entire article above, particularly #7 under “How to get a permit in Greece” should you not qualify for EU citizenship via ancestry.
2. “Common jobs for English-speaking foreigners in Greece”
3. “Job ads in Greece vs. other countries”
4. “The importance of speaking Greek in Greece”

Looking for a job as a non-EU citizen isn’t as simple as looking at ads on kariera.gr or anywhere because you need a work visa and permit. You can network, apply to jobs and interview all you want, but it still comes down to one thing: Convincing an employer that you are more qualified than any other EU citizen in Greece for that position for him/her to muck through mountains of bureaucracy, put down a deposit and sponsor you. Few if any employers want to do that, which is the reason you’ll see no one advertising “Will sponsor work visa and permit in Greece.” More likely, the ad will say “Must have authorization to work in the EU.”

I am not a job placement agency, lawyer or government agency. I’m a private citizen with a full-time career on two continents and personal obligations. Approximately 5-10 people want my help per day; (I don’t even talk to 5 of my closest friends per day!); and it would be a full-time job to provide private, individual counseling to every person who wants a job in Greece. I don’t have that kind of time. Instead I created and maintain this Web site to serve as a resource to share my experiences and what I’ve done to be successful here, plus the most current information in plain English from private notes and Greek translations I performed over 11 years. This is an investment I’ve made for the benefit of everyone, a free gift to all of you, if you want it.

Greece is also a ‘results may vary’ country as I’ve said many times. Just because I and approximately 2,000 other non-Greek, unmarried Americans have secured permits on our own, there are tens of thousands who did not.

Kat Reply:
September 18th, 2009 at 21:14

If your marriage lasted three years, you can keep your permit after the divorce. If this doesn’t apply to your situation, the only way you can keep your permit is by applying for one through your employer unless you:
a) open a business or self-employed status, see “How to start a business in Greece“;
or
b) have income of at least 2,000 euros coming from outside Greece, see “How to get a residence permit via independent means.”

Getting a permit through your employer does not mean you are tied to that one company forever. You can leave after the first year is over. See “FAQ: Greek permits.”

Learning Greek is a process and a commitment. Until then, you can enlist kindhearted people/friends to help you or hire a lawyer to handle your affairs. It’s not impossible.

Kat Reply:
September 19th, 2009 at 23:56

You didn’t provide enough information to give you a proper answer…in any case.

Being married to a Greek husband who abandoned the marriage does not qualify you to move, live and work in Greece. Yes, you are technically still married but that’s only because no one has filed for divorce (as far as you know). If you try to apply for a permit as the spouse of a Greek citizen, they will ask for copies of HIS Greek ID card, HIS tax statement (which your name should be on), proof that you are on HIS insurance policy, plus a certificate from HIS depository verifying “family situation.” If he is willing to do this for you and you both attend/pass the interview with the immigration panel, then I suppose you can get the permit…but it isn’t right, and you may be caught.

The only way you could qualify for a permit by yourself is if you were married for 3 years and were residing that whole time in Greece, which you were not. You also do not qualify for Greek citizenship, again, because you do not live/work here, speak the language, etc.; it takes much more than being married to qualify.

If you are an EU citizen or can claim EU citizenship through an ancestor, you can move to Greece. If you are a non-EU citizen, the only way you can come here is by qualifying for a permit via the methods listed above in the article.

Kat Reply:
September 26th, 2009 at 23:57

No. As you said in your comment, there is a difference between a resident and a citizen. My article states ‘citizen,’ so this doesn’t apply to you if you are not a citizen.

The only time a non-EU citizen can transfer easily between EU countries as only a ‘resident’ is if he/she has a special EU-wide permit issued to those (without a connection to an EU citizen) who have been residing/working legally in one member state for a minimum of 5 years. I also state this in the article.

Further, if you are already in Greece (which your IP address shows you are), you cannot get a permit to live and work in Greece while in the country. You must be outside Greece, be issued a ‘D’ visa by the Greek Consulate/Embassy via one of the methods I listed and re-enter.

Kat Reply:
October 26th, 2009 at 23:59

Any immigration process involves visas and permits based on one’s citizenship; Japan (or any country) demands them, why wouldn’t Greece? It was your responsibility to check with the Greek Consulate/Embassy, or your (now) Greek husband could have made a simple phone call to any government office (nomarxeia, dimos, KEP, mayor’s office) to inquire. Getting married and being the “official” wife of a Greek citizen does not make you a Greek citizen or exempt you from following the law. Ignorance is not a legitimate defense.

As detailed in “Countries that enjoy visa-free travel to Greece,” you did not need a visa to enter Greece. However, because you are immigrating as a permanent resident and staying more than 90 days, you need a permit and the law says that process should have started within 30 days of your arrival. That means you needed to marry within the first 30 days to meet the deadline.

As it says in “Overstaying a visa in Greece,” you do not qualify for a visa extension for several reasons, and it has nothing to do with being the wife of a Greek citizen:
a) An extension implies there is something valid to extend. Your visa is expired.
b) A visa extension is only given to people who are temporary visitors. You are a resident.
c) Even if you had a valid visa and were a temporary visitor, you must have an extenuating reason to be in Greece (hospital, dying relative, car accident) and have significant financial resources to support yourself. You do not have an extenuating reason.

I see only three options to fix this:
a) You get a lawyer that can use his connections to find a loophole or bribe someone who can somehow issue your permit;
b) You go to the Greek ombudsman to state your case, and hope that a compromise is worked out. See “Greek ombudsman“;
c) You exit Greece and re-enter at a later date to apply for a permit: Because you have a 90-day visa good within any 180-day period, it means you must stay out of Greece/Schengen for a total of 90 days after which it will renew. Once that happens, you can re-enter Greece and apply for your permit.

Otherwise, you will remain illegal and are therefore ineligible for insurance, work or completing any transactions in Greece. You are not trapped by the law; you are trapped by your failure to research the legalities of moving, living and working in Greece before you came here.

Good luck.

Kat Reply:
October 6th, 2010 at 01:04

This is not a complicated question for me, in fact the information is above in the article if you read it.

If you tell the Greek embassy in Bolivia that your boyfriend will be coming to Greece to marry you, they will most likely ask you to provide proof of insurance and income, either through a job (ekkatharistiko tax statement) or with money in a savings account (bank statement) of at least 8,500+1,700=10,200 euros/year. Why? Because he is a non-EU citizen and will be unemployed in Greece, so the Greek state asks the Greek/EU citizen to show that he/she can support their spouse and not burden the state system. If you cannot show this, they will deny his visa.

If you apply for the visa through the Greek embassy in Cuba with a letter and tell them you’re getting married, they will most likely ask the same thing because this is an immigration process.

Let’s say you do not tell them you are getting married, he gets a visa, your boyfriend comes to Greece, and you get married in Greece, (which must happen during the time his visa his valid, as the article says); or you get married in Cuba or Bolivia first, then come to Greece together as husband and wife. When you go to apply for the Greek residence/work permit at the municipality, they will still ask you for the proof of insurance and proof of income or proof of money in the bank. If you cannot produce this, they will deny his permit and he will be forced to leave Greece. He could also choose to stay, but he will remain an illegal resident and won’t be able to work legally or do much of anything. It does not matter that he is married to a Greek citizen. The law is the law, and you will see other comments above where people did not inform themselves and got into trouble.

If you have proof of insurance and income, no problem. If you do not, then you must decide how to proceed. All best.

Kat Reply:
October 14th, 2010 at 00:21

Hi Al,

Still haven’t gotten much sleep, but I wanted to answer you before more time passes and my browser crashes again.

I’m happy to report that your chances of living together are excellent. In the article above under the heading “How to get a permit for Greece,” you need to pay attention to the first entry, (1) “Be the non-EU spouse or child (under 21) of a Greek/EU citizen.” Letter (a) pertains to your situation in bringing your fiancee and her son into Greece. I have step-by-step instructions in “Residence permit for non-EU family members of Greek/EU citizens,” but competing websites plagiarized the post and commentators were pushy and abusive toward me, so I elected to password-protect it.

I can give you some customized guidance, in addition to the (1a) entry referenced above.

a) Visa: On December 19, 2009, the EU granted visa-free entry to Serbian citizens as I report in “Countries that enjoy visa-free travel to Greece.” If Greece is recognizing this directive, she and her son should not need visas to come to Greece. However, as you may know from living here 30 years, Greece is resistant to implementation and often has hidden rules or may require a special ‘D’ entry visa. Therefore, I highly recommend that she and her son go to the Greek consulate/embassy nearest her location and inquire what is needed to accomplish what you want.

b) Paperwork: At some point, either during the visa process or the permit process, you as the EU citizen will be asked to provide evidence of insurance coverage and income sufficient to support your future wife and her son. As the article above says, and as I advised the commentator above you, that would be: Base of 8500 + 1700 (spouse) + 1275 (dependent child). Be ready with your insurance policy and an ekkatharistiko or bank statements.

c) Marriage process: You will need to get a marriage license as soon as she gets here and get married before her visa expires (under 90 days). I recommend doing it as soon as possible. I have an article called “Getting married in Greece — for residents,” but I’m sure you can guess why it’s no longer available. She does not need a permit to get married, but she needs to marry you in order to apply for a permit for herself and her son.

d) Permit: Apply for the Greek residence/work permit as soon as you get married, as it must be done before her visa expires (under 90 days).

Before leaving her homeland, she needs to get a printed original of her birth certificate, divorce decree (if any) and a birth certificate for her son. When she has those, she’ll need to get one apostille per document from the Ministry of Justice in Serbia. Without an apostille, she cannot use Serbian documents in Greece.

Paperwork isn’t romantic, but bureaucracy takes time in Greece and you must get it out of the way or suffer the consequences. You can relax and travel later.

I cannot tell you more, but I hope that sets you in the right direction and I trust you’ll figure out the rest. If you’d like to give back to this website or correct anything I told you, please come back to share your experience to help me to help others. I’d also like to know your story had a happy ending.

Thank you for your kind words and encouragement. It makes it worth it for me.

Kat Reply:
October 21st, 2010 at 19:55

Hi Julls,

My answer to you will be almost identical to the answers I gave ‘maria-nena’ and ‘Al’ right above your comment. Did you read them? I won’t repeat myself, so please take a look because it applies to you.

Regarding your questions, you did not provide clear information, so my answers will reflect that.
– You did not say which non-EU country you are from, your IP address says you are writing from the Dominican Republic, and then you say you’re American? However, you said your country needs a visa to enter Greece, so that means you’re not American. It would have been helpful to know what passport you have.
– Go back? Go back where, America?
– As I told the two people above you, the right way is to go to the Greek consulate or embassy nearest your current residence and apply for visas for you and your child. Since you will be marrying a Greek citizen, they will be asking him for proof of income and insurance before issuing the visas and bringing you and your child over to Greece. Same thing I said to ‘Al.’
– In my opinion, it is pointless for your fiancee to fly all the way to ____ to get married. Why? Because they will ask him for the same proof no matter where he is and it won’t matter if you’re married before or after applying for a visa.

People have the notion that marrying a Greek somehow entitles them to more rights and freedom, which I think is the reason you’re talking about getting married before applying for the visa. That’s not necessarily true.
– No. If a non-EU/Greek couple wants to get married or has married recently, it creates suspicion that perhaps they got married to get a visa and a residence/work permit.
– Yes/neutral. If a non-EU/Greek couple has been married for several years before immigration of the non-EU citizen, or the non-EU citizen already had a Greek residence/work permit, then there is little or no suspicion.

Your Greek fiance will need to be more involved with bureaucracy if he intends on being with you and your child because there is a lot of paperwork in your future, and you will not be able to handle it all yourself unless you can speak/read/write Greek. Hiring a lawyer is not recommended since most of them don’t know much about bureaucracy pertaining to non-EU citizens.

All best.

Kat Reply:
November 20th, 2010 at 11:46

I say above in this article — which was published long before the US Embassy in Athens’ section — that a five-year, then a 10-year residence/work permit can be granted to non-EU family members of Greek/EU citizens if all requirements are met. The post you’re inquiring about does indeed explain everything.

If you read why it’s password-protected in “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me,” you should have also seen info about the password in the same paragraph.

All best.

Kat Reply:
January 15th, 2011 at 09:21

Applicants “may” be required to submit a health certificate, as I say. It is typical on a first-time application, but nothing in Greece is black and white and there are a lot of variables down to the person who waits on you and what mood they’re in. I know spouses who were asked and others who weren’t.

If you’re required to get one and the test is positive, it does not automatically disqualify you. The final decision will be made by the interior ministry and/or the regional committee who will interview you and your spouse to determine if your marriage is valid before issuing your residence permit. There’s no way to know in advance what they’ll decide or what options will be offered to you.

Please be aware that when I wrote this article in April 2007, there existed no article on residence/work permits for non-EU citizens in Greece on any official/commercial website or forum in any language so it’s likely the information you read was plagiarized from me. Therefore, you are not necessarily getting confirmation from different sources.

Kat Reply:
January 31st, 2011 at 00:27

As explained in the article above, you are not permitted to work in Greece as an American unless you have dual citizenship with Greece or another EU country, or you somehow secure a work permit. Getting a work permit for Greece to only work two months here will be impossible because of the cost and bureaucracy involved, plus there are plenty of workers already here who will accept wages far lower than you will.

More than 600 people lose their jobs every day, and the country will be in recession until at least 2013. If it was easy for Americans or anyone else to get a job in Greece, people would not be leaving the country to find work elsewhere.

There are hundreds, even thousands, of tips all over this website in 300+ articles.

Good luck.

Kat Reply:
February 1st, 2011 at 02:49

That’s incorrect.

This is quoted from the article above: “If you have a friend, potential spouse or relative willing to hire you, new laws passed in February 2008 require private businesses to show an annual profit of 24,000 euros and companies an annual profit of 60,000 euros before hiring non-EU citizens.” The great majority of businesses in Greece do not declare their true income to dodge taxes.

He must also prove that there is not a single Greek/EU or non-EU citizen already living here who can perform this job, in order for the employment agency and government to approve a work visa to bring you to Greece. Being as the unemployment rate is at a record high, the chances of this happening are slim. Not impossible but slim.

As I say in “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me,” I do not offer personal consultation for the many professional and personal reasons listed. If your friend is serious about bringing you to work in Greece, he’s a Greek citizen who speaks the language and can find out on his own since he’s ultimately responsible for all bureaucracy pertaining to a work visa. It has nothing to do with what works for you.

It’s nearly 3:00 a.m. now and I must get up in 3 hours to go back to work.

Best of luck.

Kat Reply:
February 28th, 2011 at 20:51

Hi Matt,

I apologize for my delayed response. I tried researching this by looking through laws in Greek and English, but I couldn’t find the exact residence permit for Greece that fits your situation. Because you would be operating as a non-profit and wouldn’t be deriving income from Greece, I believe there’s a special status you need to declare and a permit that goes with this. I know people who are doing something similar to what you describe, but I do not know first-hand under what circumstances they’re operating or what bureaucracy is involved.

My recommendation is to first visit/call the Greek embassy/consulate nearest you and find a similar organization that may be willing to share their knowledge with you, since the “official” answer almost always differs from what happens in real life. I apologize I cannot give you more solid information.

Kat Reply:
March 10th, 2011 at 01:27

Hi Sars,

Because your former residence/work permit for Greece expired 5 years ago, it won’t necessarily be easier in the way you think since laws have changed and what matters is if you meet eligibility now. However, authorities will look upon you and your spouse favorably during the interview process at the Perifeiria because you had a previous legal connection to Greece and see you didn’t marry for papers, aka, your spouse permit is likely to be approved quickly.

I recommend getting married outside Greece because the bureaucracy will be easier and less time consuming in the UK. Your marriage can then be registered at the Greek consulate/embassy nearest your current residence for the purposes of your future spouse’s family records or oikogeneiaki merida (he’ll know what this means). You could do these things in Greece, but why not keep it simple?

Where you get married does not make the Greek permit process more difficult.

Thank you for your questions, and I hope that this website can continue to help you after your move to Greece. All best.

Kat Reply:
March 12th, 2011 at 01:36

Hi Shifana,

I’m glad you found me also, so now we have each other.

Applying for your residence/work permit in Greece on your own is a typical experience, as most of us do it ourselves and very few have an employer or spouse that does it for them. You’re not alone. The ministry probably feels that they gave you the money, so they’re not obligated to do anything else even to show philoxenia (hospitality) and convey a good image.

What you’re being told about the government not providing residence permits to any immigrant in 2011 is false. There have been no changes in the law, and I know people who recently gave papers for their renewals. There are changes happening in the reorganization of municipalities, so it’s possible the building/location handling papers has changed but it has nothing to do with refusing to accept applications or not issuing permits to people who are eligible and present the correct papers.

What I recommend you do is take a Greek person with you (preferably male) and politely/calmly try once more. If that doesn’t work, then you need to file a complaint and ask help from the Greek Ombudsman. It does not cost anything, and most cases are resolved fairly quickly. Find the information at: http://www.synigoros.gr/en_index.htm

Please let me know what happens or if you need more help. Hope to see you again, and thank you for saying hello! All best.

Kat Reply:
May 18th, 2011 at 01:08

I’d like to help you, but there are important reasons I can’t.

a) You did not provide enough information: For example, citizenship, what passport you hold, if you’re finished with school or still enrolled, do you work, if you’re married and to whom (citizenship);
b) You have a lawyer: Not to be rude, but I find it a bit ridiculous that you paid a lawyer to help you, and now you’re asking me to help you for free.

Judging from the info you did give, I’d say the reason you were granted a visa and permit (for study) is no longer valid. Even if you had a Greek permit, you cannot convert one based on study to a permit based on work/residence because that it not the original reason Greece allowed you to be here, as I already explain in the article above.

The bebaiosi is a document I explain in several articles on this website, and it was clear to me you didn’t do a search or read what I wrote.

You cannot blame the municipality for negligence or claim you are a prisoner in Greece if you have no knowledge of the reasons for denial, as the denial could be for a good and/or legal reason. Some of the responsibility could be yours. Further, you are not entitled to a bebaiosi if your documents were not accepted and your permit denied; they had a right to collect it back. It’s always wise to make a copy of any document before giving it to the municipality as proof you once had it.

You did not need a lawyer. You should have come to me long ago or visited the Greek Ombudsman, who resolves cases like yours for free. That’s what you should do now: http://www.synigoros.gr

Kat Reply:
June 7th, 2011 at 01:06

Hello,

I do not have first-hand expertise on the pink card for Greece because I’ve never had one, and the process of acquiring and renewing one is not properly documented in any language. Everyone I’ve talked to with a pink card tells a different story, which confirms what I said about clarity.

First, I’ve never heard of anyone submitting a permit application at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs since they do not process or approve them, so that part of your story doesn’t make sense.

Second, a pink card is given to people who apply for political asylum, but it doesn’t grant political asylum or mean that you have refugee status. It allows you to temporarily work and reside in Greece for 6 months and is renewable as long as you have an active asylum claim and are waiting for your case to be heard.

On one hand, a pink card grants you legality and the right to live/work here without fear of expulsion, which is more than what many immigrants have. On the other hand, it leaves you in limbo and traps you in Greece so the only way you can see your daughter is if she comes to Greece to visit you.

Last, in regards to whether you can convert to a regular residence/work permit in Greece, you must consult someone with specialized legal expertise about your options. Everyone’s case is different. I recommend going to the Greek Council for Refugees in Athens. You can book an appointment via their website http://www.gcr.gr and see ‘Contact’ to get their address.

Kat Reply:
July 23rd, 2011 at 16:43

The pink (roz) card does allow you to stay and work in Greece, get medical care and be legal. However, it is a document granting temporary status, not any sort of permanent status or approval by Greek authorities. This is why all holders of pink cards are not eligible to apply for Greek citizenship.

The bebaiosi (blue paper with photo) is a receipt that certifies an applicant has submitted papers for review and possible issuance of a residence/work permit. It is not a permit; it is not a paper for 5 years.

People are under the impression that marrying a Greek or EU citizen guarantees a residence/work permit. It’s not true. In fact, a committee calls you for an interview and may determine that your marriage is an attempt to get permanent papers, then deny issuing your permit and ask you to leave Greece if you do not qualify to stay legally in another status. It can also jeopardize your pink card.

I recommend going to the Greek Council for Refugees in Athens to consult with them about your case, as each case is different. You can get their contact info and book an appointment on their website http://www.gcr.gr

Kat Reply:
August 3rd, 2011 at 14:00

Your question is similar to the person above you, and I’ll give you pretty much the same answer.

There are no restrictions on you getting married that I know of. However, because you only have a bebaiosi giving you temporary legal status and not an actual adeia paramonis (residence permit) granting you a more permanent status, it’s possible that your marriage to a Greek citizen will be viewed as an attempt to get a residence/work permit and the committee may deny issuing it. This may jeopardize the status you currently have.

Being married to a Greek or EU citizen does not guarantee a residence or work permit.

I cannot provide you with more assistance, and there’s no way to know what will happen because it’s up to the review committee. They decide.

Kat Reply:
August 12th, 2011 at 02:55

You didn’t provide enough information, but the answers you seek are already on this website.

If you are a non-EU citizen, you need to apply for a residence/work permit as the spouse of Greek citizen; your wife must help with this. If you are an EU citizen, you don’t need a permit and can start looking for a job. It says this in the first paragraph of the article above.

As explained in “The importance of speaking Greek in Greece,” you will have a difficult time finding a job because 99 percent of ads are in Greek. Either get your wife to help or settle for the ones you can read, but be aware there are very few and there are a lot of other people looking at the same ads. Unemployment is at a record high and still rising.

As I say in “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me,” I am not a job agency, nor do I provide personal consultation. This website provides more than 300 articles for free, based on 13 years experience. Help yourself. Where you cannot help yourself, your wife must be proactive and start finding out what to do by making calls or using her connections.

Good luck.

Kat Reply:
August 20th, 2011 at 14:55

How long does it take to get a permit in Greece is answered in “FAQ: Greek work/residence permits.”

Can you use a Greek permit in Germany is answered in the article above under, ‘About EU residence/work permits.’ Take a look.

The EU is not one country, and I do not know the laws governing permits of Germany and the entire EU. I found this through a simple Google search, which means you could have also: “Working in Germany.”

Because you have asked several questions without looking at the information available, I will delete future redundant questions. I cannot help you if you won’t help yourself, plus you are married to a Greek-speaking Greek citizen who can assist you. That’s more than most people have, and I prefer to spend my time creating new articles instead of repeating info I already published.

Follow-up: Your latest comment repeats the same questions but demands I answer more quickly. Good luck.

Kat Reply:
September 28th, 2011 at 20:49

America does not provide low-cost healthcare coverage plans or free insurance for unemployed persons living in the USA, unless qualifying for a special program, which is why millions are uninsured. Therefore, there’s no way it provides any sort of insurance for American citizens who voluntarily live outside its borders.

The Greek government provides for its citizens and has cross-border cooperation to a point for other EU citizens because of EC laws. The only options for non-EU citizens in Greece are private, low-cost insurance from banks or insurance companies, usually demanding an existing business relationship to qualify for a discount.

Kat Reply:
October 27th, 2011 at 22:13

Hello, nice to meet you and hear your story.

Answers to your questions, which were not a burden at all:
1. The panel conducts the interview in Greek, and there is no interpreter. Some are strict and expect people to answer in Greek; some allow you to translate his answers. There’s no way to know in advance.
2. You, as a Greek citizen, are permitted to live/work in Greece whenever you wish. Bringing your non-EU husband depends on whether you can meet requirements asked of all EU citizens and their spouses. In some (but not all) cases, they ask for proof of income and financial support because the non-EU citizen should not be a burden on Greece’s economy (already burdened by many other things) while unemployed.
3. You can be without medical insurance as a Greek citizen, but a non-EU citizen must have ongoing proof of medical insurance purchased outside or in Greece in order to apply for and renew a residence/work permit.
4. Authorities will ask you for an ekkatharistiko or dilosi from a Greek tax office to show you do not owe any taxes to Greece and proof of any assets (property, income, bank accounts, etc.). They often customize what they require to a person’s situation.

Greek citizens often have no knowledge of bureaucracy pertaining to non-EU citizens, so they give invented answers to questions you pose instead of saying ‘I don’t know.’ Therefore, asking relatives or friends may not work. This is why I ended up doing everything myself and then creating this website to inform others. Official websites are a recent invention (started after my website), do not reflect reality and are not updated on a regular basis, which makes them unreliable.

I hope you are out of danger, and that I see you here again. All my best to you.

Kat Reply:
October 28th, 2011 at 21:00

Based on the little information you gave, there’s no way I can provide a customized answer.

You are free to marry whomever you wish, assuming you are eligible. Asylum seekers, refugees and persons in an illegal status are not allowed to marry in Greece.

After marriage, you can apply for a residence/work permit as the spouse of a Greek citizen. However, the permit is not automatically granted. There is a several-months waiting period and an interview that will determine if you married for papers. If the permit is approved, you are allowed to work in Greece.

As it says in the article above, permits for one EU country are not transferable to other countries. Therefore, you cannot use this permit to work in the UK. Why? Because it was approved under the laws of Greece. In order to work in the UK, you need to qualify and apply for a work permit in the UK. See “UK Border Agency.” If you are living in the UK, you should already have a residence/work permit.

Kat Reply:
February 23rd, 2012 at 17:11

There’s no way I can answer this question, as you made it impossible in giving so little information. To send you in the right direction, I need to know:

a) What is your nationality and what passport do you have?
b) Did you enter Greece legally with a visa or visa waiver, or illegally?
c) How long have you been married to your wife?
d) Did she bring you to Greece and under what circumstances?
e) Are you working?
f) Are you making social insurance contributions?
g) Have you applied for a residence permit in Greece?
h) If no, why not and why have you waited 8 years to inquire? If yes, what was the reason they refused to issue you a permit?

The easiest way to get an answer is to visit the municipality dimos or grafeio allodapon office where your wife renews her permit and ask if you qualify for a permit or why they won’t issue you one. Good luck.

Kat Reply:
April 8th, 2012 at 12:38

Question is answered in #7 of ‘How to get a permit for Greece.’

Greece’s unemployment rate is 21 percent, while the U.S. jobless rate is 8.2 percent. Greece has no reason to import non-EU citizens with a population of well-qualified, fully bilingual Greek and EU citizens from 27 member states.

Teaching English is not a specialized profession, language schools are struggling, and there are hiring quotas, certifications required at frontistiria (see #3 in “Common jobs for foreigners in Greece: Myth and reality“) and nearly impossible profit margins that must be met before a non-EU citizen can be hired. What I’m saying is you face opposition at every level.

I had the impression you have expertise on visas and permits because you’re dispensing advice in expat forums without quoting where you learned this knowledge. Further, the forum you’re using is parasitical because it depends on users to take information from legitimate sources (like me) to attract traffic for them but forbids outside links.

Praise is appreciated. But what’s more important is readers give attribution and contribute to websites that deserve to be enriched and credited, even if it’s not mine.

Kat Reply:
May 3rd, 2012 at 23:12

Answer 1:
I received both your comments. Please read the box ‘Have a Question?’ on the front page. I’m a journalist running this website in my unpaid spare time. I don’t consider waiting less than 24 hours a long time to receive free assistance, and feel free to go straight to Greek authorities or have your wife make some phone calls if you are impatient.

Also, Kat is a woman’s name, so I am not a ‘sir.’

Answer 2:
Authorities give you a receipt when you pay a fine, and it was your responsibility to keep it. If they didn’t offer you a receipt, it was your responsibility to ask for one.

Proving you paid a fine does help, but it does not change the fact you illegally traveled to Spain on a friend’s document. This is a choice you made, and every choice has consequences.

Further, you still need to attend an interview, after which a committee decides whether to issue residence/work permits and can deny anyone they believe married for papers, including people who were once refugees or asylum seekers and people who broke the law. Being married to a Greek citizen does not guarantee you a residence/work permit. Also, if you have been married for 2 years, you should have applied for a permit right after you got married.

All you can do is do what they ask and wait for an answer. I cannot predict the outcome because “Edo Ellada.” Authorities make the final decision.

Kat Reply:
May 19th, 2012 at 22:09

The UK is not a Schengen country, so whether you can travel between Greece and the UK depends on your citizenship/passport and if you have a residence permit issued by the UKBA.

It’s impossible to answer your questions based on the little information you provided. All I can do is give general info from “FAQ: Greek permits” which may not apply.
– A permit is valid until it expires.
– You will not be able to renew your permit without the required amount of ensima, proving you were working in Greece and making social insurance contributions.
– You will lose your permit if you are outside Greece and cannot show proof of residency for at least 185 days a year.
– You cannot take up work in Greece again if your permit was tied to a specific employer.

Only those with 10-year permanent residence permits (described in the above article) or the five-year EU-wide residence permit can override some of the conditions outlined above.

Kat Reply:
May 19th, 2012 at 23:19

You didn’t provide enough information for me to help you.

If you are living/working in Greece with a residence/work permit and earn a certain income for at least two years, you can apply for a reunification visa and permit for your wife and any children at the municipality office or grafeio allodapon nearest your residence. See #2 under “How to get a permit for Greece.”

The order does not come from the Greek embassy; approval comes from the interior ministry and ministry of citizen protection, which then sends word to the embassy in Pakistan. If you have been waiting 3 years, it’s safe to say it’s been denied and you need to inquire with the municipality (dimos) or grafeio allodapon.

Kat Reply:
May 21st, 2012 at 23:40

Right now you are in an illegal status, so the answer is no, you cannot get married. The only way around this is for you to leave the country for 90 days, apply for an immigrant visa at the Greek embassy in your homeland, then re-enter Greece and get married. However, your boyfriend must show he has insurance and earns a certain income as part of eligibility.

Sometimes they give permits to mothers of children who are Greek citizens, but laws often require that the child’s parents be married at the time of the baby’s birth. This does not apply to you.

You can only renew something that is valid. Because your permit is expired, and your last permit was denied for insufficient ensima, there is no possibility to renew based on the information you provided.

Your boyfriend should be helping you and making phone calls to resolve this, especially since he is Greek and speaks the language. I do not recommend lawyers because they often promise the moon, but know nothing about laws or permits for non-EU citizens and are happy to take your money for no results. Lots of readers have complained of this, and several lawyers have plagiarized my website to fool people.

If there are other circumstances or another way, you need to inquire at the municipality office, grafeio allodapon or the Greek ombudsman.

Kat Reply:
August 16th, 2012 at 13:44

I often close posts to comments and questions after a majority of people ask redundant questions that have already been answered. As you know, I run this website in my spare time and repeating myself is unproductive and prevents me from posting new material.

1. No one has access to these pages for reasons explained under ‘Protected posts’ in “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me.” The first doesn’t apply to you since you haven’t been living in Greece for 5-10 years.

2. Having a complete file means nothing; you are waiting for approval and issuance of a permit. See ‘When will my permit sticker/card be ready?’ at “FAQ: Greek work and/or residence permits.”

3. Your friend is misinformed.
– Traveling outside Greece: Read about the blue paper (bebaiosi) and where you can go at “Non-EU citizens in Greece with a bebaiosi may travel home through 2012.” Border guards, police and passport control DO check; the perifeiria doesn’t (of course) because it’s not their job.
– AFM: Having one is not the only element needed to work in Greece.
– Working with the blue paper: The blue paper is a receipt signifying that papers have been submitted for POSSIBLE issuance of a permit; therefore, an employer can choose to recognize it or not.

It’s a shame that people do not make themselves known for years except when needing something more than the 300+ articles I already offer. Please consider giving back to the website in exchange for information you received over two years and the answers I gave today. I’d be interested in detailed notes on documents, fees, offices, etc. when getting married or the spouse permit.

All best.

Kat Reply:
August 25th, 2012 at 12:55

Read the article above to explore possible options in getting a residence permit to live in Greece.

Kat Reply:
December 1st, 2012 at 18:38

Hi Billy,

I transferred your questions to the right post, leaving a link on the original so you can find this response. I don’t mind when nice people ask questions, especially if it’s clear they made an effort to first look around, which clearly you did.

Getting her to Greece.
– Student visa: If she can get accepted to a Greek university, it should be quick and easy to get a visa and residence permit to stay during the course of her studies. Many young people choose this method if they’ve never lived in Greece before and want to see how they fit; and/or have been dating someone and want to get a real sense of being in a full-time (non long-distance) relationship, especially before marriage. If you later decide to get married, she will likely need to exit Greece, apply for a different (non-studies) visa, then re-enter the country so you can get married. Authorities may even look positively on her studies during the interview (later), as she can show an actual connection to Greece. I don’t have an article because mine use first-hand experience and I’ve never been a student in Greece. If people are willing to contribute their experience as a way to give back, I’ll write one.
– Marriage: Citizens from Ukraine need visas for Greece, so she would need to go the Greek consulate/embassy and apply for a ‘D’ visa with intention to immigrate and marry a Greek citizen. At that point, they could ask you as the Greek citizen to provide documents. If you don’t have income, it’s possible they’ll request proof from your parents. I can’t say for certain because I don’t know anyone in the same situation. If you go this route, perhaps you can tell me. She need not speak the language, but the final interview is in Greek. Refusal usually has something to do with fabricating information or a relationship (i.e,. online/mail-order brides, marrying for papers, etc.). If/when the permit is issued, it’s good for 5 years.
– Hungarian citizenship via ancestry: This would be my first choice as it would give your girlfriend a lot of freedom, but it does appear to take a long time (as it often does in Greece), so this doesn’t fit your needs.
– Cohabitation agreement: I know very little about this, so I cannot guide you. I understand the couple must show significant connection of social and financial assets. For example, proof of living together in another country or having a home, investments, business, bank accounts or children together. I’m fairly sure you’re not eligible, but please feel free to come back and share whatever you find out if using this option.

It’s purely my opinion that the student visa is fastest, the safest and gives you both a chance to experience life together and build toward a future. Second would be marriage. However, if you opt for marriage straight away, it could be a traumatic experience for her to fit into a new country, new life, new language, new house, new marriage and new family all at once. I see this too often, and it doesn’t always end well.

Two very positive things: a) Your parents support the relationship between you and your girlfriend (a non-Greek); b) you’re proactive and patient, two things you’ll need when dealing with non-EU/EEA bureaucracy.

Always a pleasure to help a polite person willing to give back. Wishing you and yours all the best.

Kat Reply:
December 9th, 2012 at 12:35

Answers to your three questions:

– Explanation of protected posts is found in the ‘Questions’ section at “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me.” It’s the same link given on the post you were trying to access.
– Regarding your wife’s mother, whom I assume is also a non-EU/EEA citizen though you did not state this, she can come to live with you if she is: a) a dependent under family reunification — has zero income and you can prove through tax statements that you earn a certain level to support her; b) financially independent and can acquire a residence permit on her own as stated in “How to get a visa and residence permit for Greece.” On that post in Comments, I answered the same question for Jeffrey on February 29, 2012.
– Consulting a lawyer is a personal choice. I do not have a high opinion of legal advice in Greece because:
a) lawyers plagiarize my website regularly to give potential clients the impression of expertise and
b) use my information to help them, as I source details that official sites don’t disclose;
c) readers come to me after being duped; and
d) 100 percent of everyone I know over 14 years who hired a lawyer to consult on non-EU matters was misguided, stalled and/or charged and cheated out of a lot of money, unless they were family friends.

Accountability is a rare thing in Greece, and most people will make up answers instead of saying ‘I don’t know.’ That’s why I stopped asking others long ago and acquired all the knowledge I have.

Kat Reply:
January 21st, 2013 at 00:18

You didn’t provide enough information for me to give a customized answer, but I suspect the answers are in the article.

a) A visa is for entering the country, staying temporarily and leaving, as explained in “What’s the difference between a visa and a permit?” I give this link above in the Visa section.
b) Also in the Visa section under Type 1 (sticker-free), it says that Americans already have Schengen privileges that grant a visa to stay up to 90 days in any 180-day period, without cost or application.
c) Assuming “I am Greek” means that you have Greek citizenship and a Greek passport, then your husband qualifies for a permit as long as you move with him. In the “How to get a permit” section in #1, it says non-EU spouses of Greek/EU citizens need to apply for a residence permit once inside the country. Due to ongoing plagiarism and copyright infringement, the linked article giving details is locked.

If you do not have Greek citizenship, it is highly recommended that you file papers to claim it as life will be significantly easier.

If your husband has dual citizenship with an EU/EEA country, he does not need a visa or permit.

Kat Reply:
February 22nd, 2013 at 10:51

These questions have been asked and answered previously, both in the article and in Comments above yours.

– All Greek/EU/EEA citizens can live in Greece without restriction, as it says in the first sentence of the article.
– Americans and other non-EU citizens granted sticker-free Schengen visas can stay in Greece, or Schengen zone, for 90 days in any 180-day period without a residence permit or any cost/bureaucracy, as it says in section, ‘Entry – Visas for Greece’ Type 1 and in the comment above yours.
– Non-EU family members (spouse and children under 21) of Greek/EU/EEA citizens are entitled to a residence/work permit to stay longer than 90 days, as it says in section ‘How to get a permit’ under #1. Your other questions are also answered in that same section, plus earlier comments as in my response to ColomboCanadian on October 18, 2011.

Wishing you all the best.

Kat Reply:
April 22nd, 2013 at 02:39

I realize that you’ve likely been to the dimos already, but there was a delay because I only answer questions in my spare time and needed a large block to reply. I’m posting this if only to clarify various points of your comment.

1. What you should have is a residence permit or a bebaiosi: There is no such thing as a residence visa, as visas are only for temporary stays and entering/exiting the country — explained in, “What’s the difference between a visa and a permit.”

2. The dikastiria isn’t involved in approving permits and visas unless legal action was involved.

3. IKA does not have a one-year lapse. IKA computers are harmonized with many agencies/ministries via e-governance and updated within 90 days or less on the number of ensima each person has. In cases where proof of the last 60 days is needed, a letter from an employer that’s been certified by police is acceptable.

4. The expiration date of an adeia paramonis is clearly stated on the card/sticker. The expiration date of a bebaiosi is usually one year from date of issuance as stated in “FAQ: Greek permits.” The exception is non-EU family members of EU citizens.

5. I’ve heard nothing on lowering the number of ensima for renewals of all permits. The gov’t in power is anti-immigration, long-term legal residents with more ensima than you describe have been refused renewal, unemployment is at a record high and Greece has no reason to retain foreign workers.
– There was discussion and lowering the ensima requirement to 120 per year in 2011 for some categories, as stated in “Residence/work permits for undocumented workers in Greece.” However, that cabinet was voted out and some legislation has been rolled back. If it was indeed lowered for everyone, I welcome corrections.
– People are allowed to purchase 20% of ensima, but no more than that.
– The gov’t in 2011 OK’d the extension of health coverage for those who could prove they earned 50 ensima, as described in section ‘Insurance for unemployed’ at “Unemployment benefits in Greece.”
– I have consistently met the original 200 ensima requirement, so I don’t have experience relevant to yours.

6. All persons normally resident in Greece are required to have a Greek driver’s license. Technically, it was never legal to only have a US license and IDL except as a visitor, but many people got away with it (and continue to) because they’re not checked and the law is/was not implemented. See, “Converting to a Greek license.”

7. A five-year permit is issued only after the applicant satisfies ALL requirements detailed in, “Long-term EU-wide permits for Greece.” I don’t know if you qualify; you need to read the list and see.

We do not share a similar status, so I’m unable to warn of pitfalls specific to your situation. Still, I hope the information and advice can help you. If you would like to correct or contribute information learned on your journey as a way to give back to the website, select any open post and I’ll transfer and credit accordingly.

It’s 2:30 in the morning, so I must sign off. Wishing you all the best.

Kat Reply:
August 15th, 2013 at 11:33

Answers to your inquiry are already explained by articles on this website.

Because you are already married, you cannot marry again in Greece as polygamy is against the law.
– As it says in the article above, marrying solely for a permit is cause for Greek authorities to deport you.
– In “How to start a business in Greece,” it says non-EU citizens must make a considerable investment and have their business approved by the Greek government.
– In “Ways to get Greek citizenship,” it says that Greek nationality is not being granted to non-Greeks.

Kat Reply:
September 10th, 2013 at 10:39

First off, you do not have a Schengen visa residence permit. A Schengen visa is permission to stay temporarily for 90 days in any 180-day period for certain non-EU citizens, including Americans. To stay in the EU/EEA past 90 days you need a residence permit. There’s no such thing as a stay visa or residence visa. You have a carte de séjour (residence permit) to live/work in France.

All EEA/EU citizens enjoy free movement in all member states, which your husband should know and is also stated in the first paragraph.

In section ‘How to get a permit for Greece,’ it says in #1 that non-EU spouses of EU/EEA citizens are eligible for a five-year residence/work permit to live/work in Greece. You need to apply upon arrival. That’s it. I don’t see a ‘unique situation,’ unless you’re in a same-sex marriage (it’s essential to be transparent; otherwise I’m forced to guess, which is unhelpful). In that case, you can apply for this residence permit, assuming you meet income requirements.

I’m 99% certain that you read this article, saw comments were closed and then searched for an open post. Please note that I closed this topic because people kept asking redundant questions, which are already answered by the info detailed above and responses to identical inquiries.

Good luck.

Kat Reply:
October 10th, 2013 at 01:46

1:
You didn’t provide enough information for me to properly address your questions, so I can only give answers based on what you disclosed.

Without knowing why your wife has a five-year permit and you don’t, you can apply for a five-year permit if you meet eligibility and go through the application process detailed in “Long-term EU-wide residence permit for Greece.”

What you were told about being hired by your wife to get a five-year permit is wrong; employees get regular one-year or two-year permits. Or adopted by her son, highly unlikely; I know of no past, existing or new legislation that would make it possible. If local authorities aren’t joking, please come back and correct me by telling me which law grants a permit via ‘parental adoption’ and the bureaucracy involved. Adult EU children can only help non-EU parents get permits if the non-EU parent is destitute, disabled, completely dependent or otherwise unable to care for themselves and the EU child can show proof of sufficient income.

2:
Authorities may not have been joking, but I’m 99% certain that they’re wrong.

Expat guides, lawyers and govt websites are light years behind me because: a) I started mine before they did; b) when plagiarizing me, they water down the info and often make errors because the plagiarizer has no expertise; c) in the case of official Greek govt sites stealing info, they don’t understand native English and copy-paste only what they feel is correct according to circulars; d) I combine all articles with first-hand experience and reader input; e) I update my info on a rolling basis and source from real people and Greek-language news; f) I’m an outsider who became an insider and can explain it better from that perspective.

Knowing the law does not necessarily make bureaucracy go faster or prevent authorities from making errors. I know this from 15 years experience.

Kat Reply:
November 6th, 2013 at 23:50

As it says under ‘How to get a permit for Greece’ in section 1a: “Being married to a Greek/EU citizen does not guarantee a residence/work permit, as I know several people who were denied.”

You are required to attend the interview and gain approval from the committee. If you don’t, no permit is issued, the bebaiosi (blue paper) is revoked, and you are required to leave Greece. God does not decide these cases.

If you stay with your wife in Greece and police find you residing here illegally, you will be fined and deported. I recommend against hiring a lawyer, as many make promises but don’t deliver positive results and only take your money. In this state of economic crisis and neo-Nazis in Parliament, it will nearly impossible to fight the decision.

Kat Reply:
March 19th, 2014 at 12:56

Please read the above article. Good luck.

Kat Reply:
March 21st, 2014 at 01:25

There is no such place as Lavedia. There is Livadia or Levadia. In any case, email is a very advanced concept and this is not the way offices conduct business in Greece or deal with bureaucracy. Everything is in person and sometimes (rarely) by phone.

Your husband should have been given a receipt for submitting the correct papers, and this receipt has a case/file number. If he doesn’t have one, he either did not submit the papers or lost the receipt. Also, visas are not handled by the prefecture; residence permits are handled by the prefecture. So I don’t know if you/he are confusing these words or he’s inquiring and submitting documents at the wrong location.

Kat Reply:
June 2nd, 2014 at 19:11

Because you are confused (as you said), I cannot answer your question or help you properly.

1. You cannot hold two residence permits for two different EU countries. You need to choose Sweden or Greece. If you apply for a permit in Sweden, they will check your background in Greece and ask for your Greek permit and invalidate it.
2. Marriage doesn’t change anything in Sweden. From what I know of Swedish immigration laws, they recognize partners. Beyond that, you need to do your own research. I found Migration SE via a simple Google search.
3. Marriage would change your permit in Greece for the worse, so I’m not sure why you’re considering this. As you now hold a permit on your own, getting married would force you to apply for a different category permit (spouse of EU citizen) and start the process all over again. Further, your boyfriend/baby father would need to live in Greece full time in order for you to qualify.
4. As it says in “FAQ: Greek work/residence permits,” there is nothing you can do to speed up anything in Greece.
5. Complaints can be filed with the ombudsman for maladministration, but not just because you want things to move faster. What you’re experiencing is a normal pace for Greece. Therefore, no claim is warranted.

I do not assume responsibility or make a habit of giving opinions on life decisions that are yours alone. Wishing you all the best.

Kat Reply:
June 18th, 2014 at 19:26

In the post above under section ‘How to get a permit for Greece,’ see #1. It explains that spouses of Greek citizens are granted permits to live and work in Greece, so you would not need to apply as a financially independent person described in “How to get a visa and residence permit for Greece.”

Based on a recent experience of a Greek citizen/American spouse, they were asked to show documentation related to not owing Greek taxes (ekkatharistiko or a dilosi – your wife will know), plus insurance for the non-EU spouse (you) and proof of residence (house ownership, lease, utility bill). Nothing on income or visas. Since you’re coming from Germany, I expect you’ll need to show your German permit.

You can come straight here and apply upon arriving in Greece. A visit to the embassy (Greek or U.S.) or homeland prior to arrival is not necessary.

If you plan to drive in Greece, I recommend taking a look at “Greek driver’s license” or “Converting to a Greek license.”

All best.

Kat Reply:
June 18th, 2014 at 18:45

There’s no way I (or anyone) can give an answer specific to your situation, as you provided almost no background information. Having an AFM and a family member owning property isn’t enough to determine if you qualify for a permit.
- Are you already in Greece? If yes, how long have you been here? What visa did you use to enter? Why haven’t you applied for a permit?
- Why are you in Greece? Student? Work? Travel?
- How long do you plan to stay?
- What is the nationality of your parents? Do they have residence permits or EU citizenship?

Take a look at the article above to determine if you qualify for a permit, or visit the nearest allodapon office if in Greece, or inquire at the Greek embassy if outside Greece.

Kat Reply:
July 7th, 2014 at 17:58

All non-EU citizens staying in Greece (or any EU country) for more than 90 days need a residence permit.

First, having a visa and having a permit are very different. See, “What’s the difference between a visa and permit?”

Second, as it says in the article above under section “How to get a permit” and #6, you should have applied for a residence permit. Your visa cannot be extended. Further questions are answered in “FAQ: Greek residence and work permits.”

All best.

Kat Reply:
July 14th, 2014 at 11:09

There are no visas or residence permits for non-EU citizens in relationships with Greek citizens, as it says in the article above. You must be a spouse of a Greek citizen or look at other options listed in section, ‘How to get a permit for Greece.’

Kat Reply:
October 10th, 2014 at 20:03

See #1 in section ‘How to get a permit for Greece.’ Marriage to a Greek citizen does not guarantee you will be granted a residence/work permit. I know many people who were refused.

A permit for Greece is not a permit for the entire EU. This privilege must be earned after 5 years living in Greece. See ‘Long-term EU-wide permit for Greece.’

All 28 countries have separate immigration laws. The EU is a union of member states, not one country. If your girlfriend is interested in moving to the UK, she can research their laws. Here’s a link: https://www.gov.uk/browse/visas-immigration/eu-eea-commonwealth It’s not as simple as being married and moving, and this is the case for all EU countries.

Kat Reply:
December 15th, 2014 at 11:19

Read the article above. All best.

Kat Reply:
January 11th, 2015 at 18:18

First, some clarifications.
- My definition of urgent is a life-threatening event or something similar.
- ‘Have a Question?’ on the front page states my commitments up front. Repeated postings won’t prompt me to answer sooner.
- I’m not obliged to keep comments open or answer questions, especially not on demand. This is a site I run and maintain in my unpaid time.
- Your question/comment wasn’t deleted as you claim. It enters moderation, and a message tells you this after hitting ‘enter.’
- Questions longer than 140 characters and/or of a complex nature shouldn’t be posted on Twitter.
- Unlimited personal consulting via email is unavailable. That’s the job of civil servants, which my taxes pay for.
All of these things are stated at, “Comments, Questions and Contacting Me.” I know you visited this page, but it’s clear you didn’t read it. If you had, several misunderstandings would have been avoided.

About your situation. Ignorance is not a defense.

My website has been online since 2007, and in the section above called ‘How to get a permit for Greece’ under entry #1a on spouses of Greek citizens, it says that non-EU spouses must pass an interview before a permit is issued.

Assuming you didn’t know about my website, it was YOUR responsibility to check status of the permit on a regular basis. As it says in ‘FAQ: Greek work/residence permits‘ under ‘When will my permit card/sticker be ready?’ it takes approximately 60-90 days for issuance of spouse permit, during which time you are called to interview. You applied in April 2014, so that means you should have begun following up no later than June 2014. Most people begin following up within 30 days. Instead you waited ’til October 2014, six months later.

The time of interview is set by the government, not you, and the notice is mailed to the address you gave on the application. If you gave the wrong address or moved, that’s not the fault of the government. It’s your job to inform them. The post office makes at least two attempts to deliver and then leaves a notice saying that you can pick it up at your convenience. It waits 14 days before sending it back.

The government is not obliged to give you another chance, as it wasn’t their fault. It’s a privilege to be issued a residence/work permit. If this was important to you, then you should have been: a) Checking status of your permit on a consistent basis (and earlier than six months); and b) Watching your mail; and c) Asking questions.

Should you appeal their decision in court, it only matters what you can prove (evidence); it doesn’t matter what you say or who you blame (claims). Greece isn’t welcoming of foreigners to begin with, unemployment is high, and they conduct these interviews to root out non-EU citizens who marry Greeks for permits. In their eyes, this is how it looks:
- He didn’t check on the permit. Why? Was he outside Greece (aka, not living here)?
- He didn’t get the mail. Why? Did he give a false address? Where was he and/or his wife for 14 days?
In addition, they’ll look into your background and find extracurricular male-male activities that cast doubt on the validity of your marriage. Greece is a conservative country, and this won’t help your case.

You can’t apply for a work permit via your employer because they gave you the job based on an existing permit application (bebaiosi) as the spouse of a Greek citizen. They didn’t bring you into Greece to specifically work for them in that job and then secure your work permit. To go this route, you would need to divorce your wife, exit Greece and then have this employer convince the Greek gov’t of why they need to hire you and not any other EU citizen in the entire EU. See section ‘How to get a permit for Greece’ entry #7.

Since I don’t have access to your file and details you gave here don’t match what you said on Twitter, there’s no way I can advise further. I recommend consulting a lawyer and Greek authorities about the possibility of rescheduling, or accepting that you must leave Greece in April and try another country. All best.